So far nothing has worked. Tried the v$pwfile_users and it returned no rows! Tried your connect internal trick - nada! Tried changing the internal password using oradim - nothing. Recreated the password file multiple times - rebooted - nothing! We are tearing our hair out now.... sys will logon fine as sysoper or normal but not sysdba. Internal can't logon as all. System still will work with normal. Any more ideas??? Nothing that I have gotten from metalink has worked.